Shiteaters: The Troll Generation

[bostonlurk0r]

Can we still get angry and argue about vague/obfuscated political/cultural/generational conflict?

An older dude close to me informed me tonight that fear and greed are far more pervasive than previously and implied that we are all fucked. I, being saturated in liberal yet ineffectual Internet culture, still have faith.

Once we take over the mainstream media...

[bostonlurk0r]

Positive spin: Progress is always slow; old people are burned out and disillusioned.

[Cardboard_Dog]

Porch I still appreciate your ability to say the worst possible thing with unflagging internet aplomb.



Greed is the unavoidable end result of a Capitalist system. It is proportionally more flawed than socialism. Socialism at least has a basis in equality and unity. Capitalism begins and ends with the idea of throwing a pack of ravenous dogs into a pit and waiting for the victor to emerge bloodied yet unscathed, and has the brass balls to call it "opportunity". Anyone who's ever worked in a competitive environment knows exactly how to advance and the levels you have to sink to, to do so. I'm only slightly jaded so blow me.

I hate Corporate america. Sorry .. i KNOW how many people work for corporations and I'm sympathetic to the idea that in order to buy a house and raise a family, that at this juncture, Corps provide the most security and the easiest route to achieve it but .. that in itself is the problem. It's not the people who work for the Corps .. although some can be absolute douche bags .. its the societal bs that a corporation with nagging investors creates. Cheap products sold at a higher pace for more money. High Fructose corn syrup is just a small example of that mindset. And it can only get worse.

[Cardboard_Dog]

DOUBLE POST!!

[pmahnn]

Invalid. Second post should not be the one stating double post.

[pmahnn]

Sorry .. i KNOW how many people work for corporations and I'm sympathetic to the idea that in order to buy a house and raise a family, that at this juncture, Corps provide the most security and the easiest route to achieve it but .. that in itself is the problem.

A few things. One, can you put some constraints around corporations? Does this include small companies, maybe 100 employees. Or are they the Microsofts, BPs, Alcoas of the world? Two, I'm not certain corps (even without constraints) provide security for buying a house and raising a family. Mass layoffs happen and there is no dedication to the employee. The execs in the downtown office don't seem to consider the impacts of laying off 5,000 people from a town in Ohio.

I'd say small businesses offer the best security if only because the owners are more emotionally invested in their employees and local community's well being.

[600#gorilla]

Invalid. Second post should not be the one stating double post.

both of you are dabberz.

................................. = oops.

[Tronic]

http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/visualizations/the-billion-dollar-o-gram-2009/

[Cardboard_Dog]

Sorry .. i KNOW how many people work for corporations and I'm sympathetic to the idea that in order to buy a house and raise a family, that at this juncture, Corps provide the most security and the easiest route to achieve it but .. that in itself is the problem.

A few things. One, can you put some constraints around corporations? Does this include small companies, maybe 100 employees. Or are they the Microsofts, BPs, Alcoas of the world? Two, I'm not certain corps (even without constraints) provide security for buying a house and raising a family. Mass layoffs happen and there is no dedication to the employee. The execs in the downtown office don't seem to consider the impacts of laying off 5,000 people from a town in Ohio.

I'd say small businesses offer the best security if only because the owners are more emotionally invested in their employees and local community's well being.

It's really just a broad assertion. I mean, the idea of the corporation is simple. But Limited liablity, tax shelters, and responsibilty to investors are like open doors for corruption. And there are plenty of documented cases on Google to back this up but I'm lazy. Accepting wel-fare and then shipping thousands of customer service jobs over seas is a good example. Where's the customer loyalty in that? Or laying off thousands of lower level employees to increase short term profit? Same deal. I agree that small businesses are the the best course for employment but in many cases smaller businesses can't compete with larger corps when it comes to retirement and healthcare benefits. ANd in many cases the salary cap is much lower.

As a independant contractor I avoid using Home Depot and Lowes as often as I can. They are often twice as expensive and the lumber and quality of tools is much lower. Unfortunately These larger companies are putting smaller lumber companies and home improvement centers out of business. People pay whatever just to have the convenience of a home depot right down the street.

[pmahnn]

As a independant contractor I avoid using Home Depot and Lowes as often as I can. They are often twice as expensive and the lumber and quality of tools is much lower. Unfortunately These larger companies are putting smaller lumber companies and home improvement centers out of business. People pay whatever just to have the convenience of a home depot right down the street.

Quite a few years ago I was engaged in a project to build a garage climbing wall. We used the very convenient (half mile away) Home Depot for our supplies. I'd say 1 of ever 4 pieces was not warped to shit. 1 for the cart, 3 for the floor. Epic crap. There used to be a lumber supplier, 84 Lumber, near my home town growing up. I have fond memories of taking trips there with my dad. All the free pencils you needed. Good times! They're gone.

As for tools being crap...really? No one is making you buy a Ryobi Five Piece 18v toolset. I've had great experience with DeWalt and Milwaukee, which I'm fairly certain they stock.

Oh well. I know what you're saying. I shop the local Ace hardwares in town as opposed to going to the Home Depot. They've always had what I needed, considering how much smaller they are than Home Depot.

[Lox]

I believe this article cuts to the heart of the issue you gents are speaking of, namely, disproportionate accumulation of wealth:

"Consider: in 1928 the richest 1 percent of Americans received 23.9 percent of the nation's total income. After that, the share going to the richest 1 percent steadily declined. New Deal reforms, followed by World War II, the GI Bill and the Great Society expanded the circle of prosperity. By the late 1970s the top 1 percent raked in only 8 to 9 percent of America's total annual income. But after that, inequality began to widen again, and income reconcentrated at the top. By 2007 the richest 1 percent were back to where they were in 1928—with 23.5 percent of the total.

Each of America's two biggest economic crashes occurred in the year immediately following these twin peaks—in 1929 and 2008. This is no mere coincidence. When most of the gains from economic growth go to a small sliver of Americans at the top, the rest don't have enough purchasing power to buy what the economy is capable of producing. America's median wage, adjusted for inflation, has barely budged for decades. Between 2000 and 2007 it actually dropped. Under these circumstances the only way the middle class can boost its purchasing power is to borrow, as it did with gusto. As housing prices rose, Americans turned their homes into ATMs. But such borrowing has its limits. When the debt bubble finally burst, vast numbers of people couldn't pay their bills, and banks couldn't collect."

"A second parallel links 1929 with 2008: when earnings accumulate at the top, people at the top invest their wealth in whatever assets seem most likely to attract other big investors. This causes the prices of certain assets—commodities, stocks, dot-coms or real estate—to become wildly inflated. Such speculative bubbles eventually burst, leaving behind mountains of near-worthless collateral."

<snipped>

"But starting in the late 1970s, and with increasing fervor over the next three decades, government did just the opposite. It deregulated and privatized. It increased the cost of public higher education and cut public transportation. It shredded safety nets. It halved the top income tax rate from the range of 70–90 percent that prevailed during the 1950s and '60s to 28–40 percent; it allowed many of the nation's rich to treat their income as capital gains subject to no more than 15 percent tax and escape inheritance taxes altogether. At the same time, America boosted sales and payroll taxes, both of which have taken a bigger chunk out of the pay of the middle class and the poor than of the well-off.

Companies were allowed to slash jobs and wages, cut benefits and shift risks to employees (from you-can-count-on-it pensions to do-it-yourself 401(k)s, from good health coverage to soaring premiums and deductibles). They busted unions and threatened employees who tried to organize. The biggest companies went global with no more loyalty or connection to the United States than a GPS device. Washington deregulated Wall Street while insuring it against major losses, turning finance—which until recently had been the servant of American industry—into its master, demanding short-term profits over long-term growth and raking in an ever larger portion of the nation's profits. And nothing was done to impede CEO salaries from skyrocketing to more than 300 times that of the typical worker (from thirty times during the Great Prosperity of the 1950s and '60s), while the pay of financial executives and traders rose into the stratosphere."

http://www.thenation.com/article/36893/unjust-spoils?page=full

Discuss!

[KIX]

discuss what?

powerlessness?

old people are burned out and disillusioned.

just let me dust off my ideals.

[Cardboard_Dog]

Quite a few years ago I was engaged in a project to build a garage climbing wall. We used the very convenient (half mile away) Home Depot for our supplies. I'd say 1 of ever 4 pieces was not warped to shit. 1 for the cart, 3 for the floor. Epic crap. There used to be a lumber supplier, 84 Lumber, near my home town growing up. I have fond memories of taking trips there with my dad. All the free pencils you needed. Good times! They're gone.

As for tools being crap...really? No one is making you buy a Ryobi Five Piece 18v toolset. I've had great experience with DeWalt and Milwaukee, which I'm fairly certain they stock.

Oh well. I know what you're saying. I shop the local Ace hardwares in town as opposed to going to the Home Depot. They've always had what I needed, considering how much smaller they are than Home Depot.

It's funny you mentioned the pencils because I was going to put .38$ pencils in quotations .. seriously. They were always a courtesy. It may seem trivial to some but it is a part of the issue. DUDE . I'm not talking about cheap Ryobi tools .. I'm saying that the tools that Home CHeapo gets from Porter Cable and DeWalt are generally of lesser quality. That is why Home D. has no problem with a tool return. It happens all the time. DEFECTIVE. They just suck. And unless you are using that tool to death everyday most never even notice. But I digress.

[Cardboard_Dog]

And that article has too many topics to discuss and I don't want to type that much right now. If you go into the richest 2% of the nation, not surprisingly the amount of Americas wealth they control more than doubles. That, besides the amount of money invested in the War on drugs, still, every year, is one of the worst statistics I've ever seen.

[Lox]

How do they expect people to buy into the notion of American prosperity if it only exists for those who manage to escape the violence and poverty of their home country ?!?!?!

[pmahnn]

Got a buddy who took a job doing data analysis for the DoJ. Said one of his recent projects was figuring out the effectiveness of the war on drugs. He wanted to stab his eyes out with a roach clip.

[Cardboard_Dog]

you mean it's not effective?

[skav]

All of the tools sold at Home Depot are absolute crap. Even their full tang steel singlejacks break because the handle insert isn't well attached. Most of their striking/digging tools are made out of inferior/soft metal and not worth shit. Epoxied sledge hammers are a waste of time if you actually need to smash something. Replacement handles are almost never made to the right tolerances so you've either got something too loose or that needs to be shaved down before it can be fitted. Nobody that works there knows what the fuck is going on. And no, I don't want a fucking advertisement when I walk into your store. Leave me alone.


/rant

[skav]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38338496/ns/us_news-life/

State of California: Trolling the Federal Government

[Cardboard_Dog]

DAMN!!!! lucky. I was supposed to be there at the end of August .. but now I will be in the ADaks.